OpenStreetMap logo OpenStreetMap

Changeset When Comment
172675204 3 months ago

Many thanks for your replies.
Regarding the reply from @Fraxi: this is no argument not to add for all shop nodes the address. Sure, if there is e..g an office building where you have 10 different offices, 2 per floor, the building is cluttered with nodes and visually only few will be displayed. However, important is that the data is there, that Apps and data crawlers can get the info about that there is the particular shop.

My practical experience is that it is often impossible to divide a building into shapes to match house numbers. For example a shopping mall can house dozens of shops and for example in Germany these shops will have different house numbers, depending what street is the nearest to their location in the building. So the mall building can have a different street address than the shops inside. Then some areas have strange numbering history, like some cities use e.g. 7, 7A, 7B, while other use 7, 7B (so there is no 7A), some use 7A, 7B (there is no plain 7), some use "7" for the main building, but the shops inside all have numbers like "7/1" etc. There are so many different possibilities to number a shop. Some shops use for example post boxes, thus have a completely different address than their location would imply. So the most save and clear is to add the house number and also street to the shop. It does not harm but assures the data are available. I mean, no mapper is forced to add the address, but it makes sense to do so and instead of informing mappers about possible doubling of data, one should inform mappers that having the address for the shop is an advantage.

172675204 3 months ago

Can you please point me to the page where the Bulgarian community came to the consensus?

I think we have a misunderstanding: I don't change adresses of houses, only add shops and state it the shop nodes the complete address. This does not harm, but has the advantage that any web-crawler get the full info for a shop - and this is what not only shop owners but also users like me need. For example in OSMAnd~ I tap on a shop node and get all info. And there are many apps around offering info from OSM. If the shop later closes, the node can be deleted and that's it.

172675204 3 months ago

I got this already as on almost every change I got this info. But it is not wrong to add the address explicitly. I am not stubborn, have my reasons to use the address. As a former business owner I know well how search engines work - they evaluate the node and it helps a lot if the node of the shop has the address.

I don't get why nobody takes my argument. So here again:
* what is wrong to add an address to a shop node?
* how is it assured that AI crawlers get the address when they found the node of a shop?

166050646 4 months ago

Many thanks! The other change is correct, because you labeled it as a halt, therefore it belongs to the category "railway stop" and this is what the other person did.
By the way, I just found out that there is a second railway halt in Rome with the same name:
node/1313285443

166050646 4 months ago

Let's please be constructive. You are an experienced mapper and our common goal is to collect and distribute information. Therefore please help to improve Wikidata. Its aim is exactly this - collect there all information and distribute it. And that is why I for example connect in Wikidata the OSM nodes/ways/relation.
If you have knowledge, please share it, just fix bugs you see.
Regarding the license, it is simple: also only data publicly available can legally be added to the Wikidata. So the legal status of the sources matters. And of course, if you have e.g. the official FS station classification, you can distribute this info to Wikidata and OSM. If they don't offer such info publicly, then you are of course not allowed to distribute this info.
many thanks and regard, donovaly

166050646 4 months ago

> you should check the aerial imagery

When I map I always have the satellite as underlay. But how does that help? It is up to the railway infratructure companies to declare a station type. For example for Germany I have the official station index of the company "DB InfraGO" and map accordingly and their classifications are, well kind of random. In some OSM stations I saw explanations like "if there is no railway switch, it is a halt", but this does not match the classification.

166050646 4 months ago

> Generally the OSMF-policy does not allow taking information from Wikidata / Wikipedia.
Really? That is strange. But be it.

166050646 4 months ago

I took the info from the Wikidata:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3969884
Feel free to revert. I had a quick look but I could not find the official station register of the FS. And
https://www.rfi.it/en/stations.html
does not provide enough info.

167406214 7 months ago

When I remember correctly iD told me that I should add "network:wikidata" as well as "train=yes".
I read here:
train=*
"This tag is mainly used for trains which are not a tram=*, subway=* or monorail=* train. It may overlap with light_rail=* in some cases."

I don't have strong feelings about this. Feel free to change it or I change it.

157056611 7 months ago

Danke dir. Das mit den ÖBB habe ich bisher genommen. Nur verstehe ich nicht, warum ein Bahnhof wie Skopje dort nicht drin ist. Überhaupt finde ich keine IBNRs für Nordmazedonien.

165425601 7 months ago

This was a mistake. I remember I had to split the path and then maybe forgot to check the level settings. I fixed it now

167070033 7 months ago

Hmm, ich denke ich weiß nun was du meinst: bei den Nodes für die HPs, die ich erstellt habe, willst du das diese Node nicht Mitglied der Relation ist sondern die Node der halteposition. OK, kann ich machen. Wäre aber gut zu wissen, wo das definiert ist, dass man das so machen muss.
Ich habe es für Rodewisch wie von dir gewünscht geändert.

167070033 7 months ago

Ich verstehe noch nicht das Problem. Was genau habe ich falsch gemacht und wo ist definiert, dass es falsch ist und wie es richtig ist?

Der Haltepunkt war nicht als solcher vorhanden, nur die Position, an der die Züge halten. Aber die Position, an der der Zug hält ist nicht gleich der Haltepunkt. Der haltepunkt ist das komplette Betriebsgelände. Dieser Node ist daher fast immer nicht mit dem Gleis verbunden, sondern irgendwo auf dem Bahnsteig, den Unterstand/Gebäude etc.

Also alles was ich gemacht habe, ist eine Node für den Haltepunkt erstellt. Der Node für die Halteposition ist unverändert.

Der Node für den HP bekommt Wikidata, Wipipedia, Website etc., nicht die Halteposition.

> Nun haben wir viele Route-Relationen, die einen public_transport=station abseits des Gleises als member haben, während der neue public_transport=stop_position nicht member der Route-Relationen ist.

OK, die Relation kann ich fix anpassen. Ich mappe auch auf dem Balkan, wo ich auch wohne und dort ist immer der Bhf/Hp teil der Relation, nicht die Halteposition.
In D ist es recht inkonsistent. Ich schaue eigentlich, dass ich nur den Bahnsteig zur Relation hinzufüge, ansonsten die Relationen nicht ändere, also den Bhf/Hp nicht hinzufüge, wenn es die Halteposition bereits ist.

167197713 7 months ago

Wieso löschst du die Relation? Mir geht es um die Verknüpfung von Wissen. Es gibt einen Wikipedia-Artikel, also ist es relevant. Leute wohnen in der gegend, wollen wissen, wo eine bahnlinie mal lang ging.
Und überhaupt, warum stört dich das? Du kannst ja die Teile, die nicht mehr sichtbar sind als solche kennzeichnen. Die werden dann ja nicht mehr auf der normalen Karte angezeigt. Aber Informationen zu vernichten, das leuchtet mir nicht ein.

157056611 8 months ago

Many thanks! I would like to add IBNR numbers to other stations in the Balcans (Kosovo, North Macedonia etc.) What database did you use to get the IBNR numbers? I see you referenced "DB API". Do you have a link for me to that API?

164414473 8 months ago

Many thanks for your additions.

However, you draw footpaths through houses. Also, simple sidewalks like in that case are not drawn in as footpath to not clutter the map. Please use instead of a path for the road the tag "sidewalk".

163947038 9 months ago

Off-topic:
as I am new in the city, is there e.g. a monthly meeting of OSM mappers in Sofia? I never met a mapper in person and I am interested to hear and learn.

163947038 9 months ago

> I've opened https://github.com/osmandapp/OsmAnd/issues/22143.
Many thanks!

> For OsmAnd and int_name see https://github.com/osmandapp/OsmAnd/issues/15579
Thanks too. After reading this I don't understand why OSMAnd~ does not use it.

163947038 9 months ago

I corrected the transliteration now:
changeset/163982525

163947038 9 months ago

It seems OSMAnd~ uses
https://translit.cc/bg
if no name:en is given.
I got translit.cc as first hit when googling but this one does not follow the Bulgarian rules.