I've reverted your changes to Cypress Point as they were destructive and littered the course with duplicate course features along with contributed bad mapping practices. Please read up the golf_course wiki before making any further changes.

Some things to consider:
* Don't delete other's work. Modify it instead to preserve history
* Don't cross the lines defining feature areas (roughs, fairways, tees, greens, etc)
* Use proper multipolygons

Thanks.

RE: way/1248229983, et al

When drawing golf course areas (i.e. greens, fairways, bunkers, tees, etc.), please be aware that the ways (lines) used to outline those areas must not cross over each other. Fairway outlines shouldn't cross over greens or bunkers or other fairways for example. Take a look at osm.wiki/File:Golf.png for an example of the "Wrong" way to map a fairway and a green along with the right way. There are some cases where a fringe exists around a green and you should draw the fairway outline completely around a green, leaving room for the fringe. Other times, the fairway and green butt up against each other. In that case the fairway and green should share the same nodes at the boundary between the two, and every node at the boundary needs to be shared leaving no gaps. When drawing these shared nodes, editors like iD (built into openstreetmap.org) will "snap" to an existing node if you get close enough. If you have any questions about golf course mapping, feel free to reach out. Thanks.

RE: way/1458602858, et al

When drawing golf course areas (such as greens, fairways, bunkers, tees, etc.), please be aware that the ways used to outline those areas can't cross over each other. Fairway outlines shouldn't cross over greens or bunkers or other fairways for example. If you could go back and clean up where you've made this mistake, that would be helpful. But more importantly, if you could stop from doing this in the future, it would be greatly appreciated. Please read the wiki for instructions and examples of how to better map golf courses: leisure=golf_course#Common_mapping_pitfalls. If you have any questions about golf course mapping, feel free to reach out.

This change has been reverted as it introduced too many errors onto the map (along with some needed edits I'm sure). Please do not break existing relations between fairways, greens, and roughs. And please don't create lollipops as a hack workaround proper multipolygons. Please make sure you read the wiki before proceeding with more golf course edits. Thanks.

RE: way/1457983693

When drawing golf course areas (such as greens, fairways, bunkers, tees, etc.), please be aware that the ways used to outline those areas can't cross over each other. Fairway outlines shouldn't cross over greens or bunkers or other fairways for example. If you could go back and clean up where you've made this mistake, that would be helpful. But more importantly, if you could stop from doing this in the future, it would be greatly appreciated. Please read the wiki for instructions and examples of how to better map golf courses: leisure=golf_course#Common_mapping_pitfalls. If you have any questions about golf course mapping, feel free to reach out.

RE: relation/19118627

Thanks for your contributions Ben. We do appreciate them. But we need to work together as a community and when you are introducing many many errors into the map that others have to come behind you and clean up, it creates tension. Please don't get upset and tell us to "relax". You are causing more work for others and we want to help you eliminate these and make all of our lives easier and make the map cleaner.

As for the above mentioned node. It is at the boundary of a fairway and a bunker. Those two items need to share every node along that boundary and not zig-zag across each other. I see that you are using JOSM now and I commend that change. There is a feature of JOSM where you can "Follow" an existing line by sharing nodes. So if the bunker exists and you are drawing the fairway, touch the first shared node and then the next shared node to set direction. Press F once and it will extend the line to the next node in the given direction. Hold F and it will continuously extend the line until the area is closed or it comes to an intersection. Hope this helps.

RE: way/1350746944 (and others)

You have made a common error when saw a fairway that looked like it didn't have a proper "Feature Type" defined and decided to add the fairway tag. The hole was already properly tagged, but was part of a relation of multiple objects known as a multipolygon. Please read this short wiki where I've tried to explain what you are looking at and avoid making the mistake in the future. osm.wiki/ID_understanding_golf_course_relations Thanks.

How embarrassing. I've done thousands of these edits. I must have been lacking sleep for this edit. My apologies.

RE: way/1455348653

Please don't share the nodes of the green if you have the fairway surrounding the green. If you can't see any fringe around the green, you should make the fairway butt up to the green and share the nodes on the boundary *between* the green and fairway instead. Please read the wiki for visual examples and instructions on how to better map golf courses: leisure=golf_course#Common_mapping_pitfalls. If you have any questions, please let me know and I'll gladly help clarify things. Thanks!

Hey Pizza,

How did you come across this tee box to make this change?

I have a biased opinion about adding both golf=tee nodes at the same time as golf=tee areas. First off, the concept of a tee node is really kind of arbitrary and nearly impossible to tell from imagery, whereas a tee box is far more likely to be visible and easily mapped. So claiming that one knows exactly at which point in the box to tee off from is specious at best. So with that, I've been deleting the tags off of the start of the golf hole when they are inside a tee area. The wiki says put the tag on the node OR the way, so that's a little justification for what I'm doing, though I agree that point could be argued.

(I kind of feel the same way about golf=pin since that is clearly wrong 99.9% of the time as the hole is moved across the green on a regular basis. But I haven't made any edits to reflect that, and don't really plan to at this time.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks. Yeah, I've been cleaning up golf courses over the last 3 years in hopes that people won't see these bad habits and spread them around farther.

Also, you are deleting a bunch of historical data in this change in order to recreate features from scratch. It's bad to lose all of that history and context when you do this, so please stop deleting and do your best to modify instead.
Thanks.

RE: way/1456745514

When drawing golf course areas (such as greens, fairways, bunkers, tees, etc.), please be aware that the ways used to outline those areas can't cross over each other. Fairway outlines shouldn't cross over greens or bunkers or other fairways for example. If you could go back and clean up where you've made this mistake, that would be helpful. But more importantly, if you could stop from doing this in the future, it would be greatly appreciated. Please read the wiki for instructions and examples of how to better map golf courses: leisure=golf_course#Common_mapping_pitfalls. If you have any questions about golf course mapping, feel free to reach out.

Hi Steve,

Thanks for contributing to golf course mapping. We need all the help we can get.

However, there are some problems with how you're mapping and I want to make sure you correct those behaviors so they don't continue into the future.

The first problem is that you are deleting information by removing someone else's work (a completely valid fairway, for instance). This is useful data in that history of the previous hole that gets difficult to find when you erase it to draw your own elements. You should modify the nodes (add/move/delete) if you need to, but deleting the entire way is frowned upon.

One common misconception is that a fairway looks like just a "line" when it is supposed to be defined as a "fairway" and an "area". Here is a wiki article that might clear that up: osm.wiki/ID_understanding_golf_course_relations

Those fairway relations are correct and should not have parts deleted because it doesn't look right. If you are unclear, please reach out and provide examples for me to look and help explain what's going on.

Thanks!

Hi Steve,

Thanks for contributing to golf course mapping. We need all the help we can get.

However, there are some problems with how you're mapping and I want to make sure you correct those behaviors so they don't continue into the future.

The first problem is that you are deleting information by removing someone else's work (a completely valid fairway, for instance). This is useful data in that history of the previous hole that gets difficult to find when you erase it to draw your own elements. You should modify the nodes (add/move/delete) if you need to, but deleting the entire way is frowned upon.

One common misconception is that a fairway looks like just a "line" when it is supposed to be defined as a "fairway" and an "area". Here is a wiki article that might clear that up: osm.wiki/ID_understanding_golf_course_relations

Those fairway relations are correct and should not have parts deleted because it doesn't look right. If you are unclear, please reach out and provide examples for me to look and help explain what's going on.

Thanks!

RE: way/1455461105

Please don't put double nodes at the end of the hole definition. I see this once in a while and am confused as to why people are doing this. Maybe you could clear it up for me. Is some documentation (wrongly) telling you to do this?

Please see the wiki page at golf=hole for better understanding of how to map out golf=hole lines. Thanks.

please make sure golf course areas don't overlap in the future. fairways shouldn't intersect tees or greens for example.

Hi Payton,

I've reverted this changeset as there are dozen of problem edits that would take more effort to fix than to apply correctly.

There were a ton of golf objects that were sloppily overlapping other objects (fairways and tees for example). I realize these might have been done before, but you need to fix them if you're making changes.

The other big problems is that you are adding a "hole=6" tag when the correct "ref=6" tag already exists. You are also breaking up tee boxes into color tees. If you can't actually see these on the ground/imagery, you should just mark a single tee box. Yardage marker colors and distances should be put on the golf=hole object and shouldn't use the "yards" key. You shouldn't just be making stuff up. The correct tag is dist and technically should be in meters, but I believe it would be valid to say "dist:red=234 yards" on the golf=hole.

I'm happy to work with you to show you correct golf course mapping. There is also the wiki.openstreetmap.org that is full of good information on golf course tags. Or join the OSM US Slack server and discuss things in the #golf channel.

Hi Benny,

We've discussed this with you several times in the past. You are deleting valid map objects that belong to relations and are recreating the objects (fairways typically) from scratch leaving broken multipolygon definitions around.

If you continue to do this, I, and possibly others, will start reverting your hard work. Please make sure you edit existing fairways in place and stop breaking multipolygons.

If you don't understand any of this, you can find more information about multipolygons and relations at the wiki. If you still don't understand, please reach out with questions and we'll gladly help you map correctly so that the community doesn't have to clean up errors.

Thanks.

Please don't remove relations on golf courses. If you are having problems with your software (Chad's Tool perhaps?), you need to work with the developer to fix their software, not break mapping in openstreetmap.