Done, thanks for pointing that out. A lot changed in 3 months!

The tracks in the road, these tracks: https://photos.app.goo.gl/z8KdFZEak4A9UFNQ8 are still there. They aren't abandoned -- they are disused. I peeked through the fence and the rails continue. I could see them in the aerials and didn't see any reason on the ground why I shouldn't trust the aerials (e.g. demolition more recent than the aerials). Being military, and me being a foreigner, I made no attempt to enter.

It also restored data of existing objects that I have verified exist, so yeah.

The problem with "delete willy-nilly" that that the people doing the deleting usually haven't actually BEEN to the location. They are relying on aerial photos, which as we well know are not reliable. They can serve well as a *hint* for field work, but they are not sufficient.

People have gotten into the habit of deleting stale bulk imported data, but that is not the same as deleting something that someone added on purpose.

We don't have a good notification for "Hey, that thing you added? Somebody deleted it." That is why deletion is a delicate subject and usually results in conflict. It's better to add things to OSM than to delete. It's not like everything that could be added has already been added!!

No, it's the responsibility of the person who believes that something which is accurate (as opposed to TIGER crap left over from Dave Hansen), but no longer present to move it to OHM. Why? Because we have NO notification system which tells an editor that (as you say) cares about the feature that someone has deleted it rather than moving it to OHM.

How about this plan: rather than create the absence of something (hard to detect that something doesn't exist anymore), if you think something belongs in OHM, then tag it with OHM=yes ?

If you agree this is reasonable, then I'll start promoting it.

Historical data must not be deleted unless it is incorrect. It should be moved to OpenHistoricalMap. If you aren't willing to do that, then you shouldn't delete it.

We don't rely on imagery to delete things. It can be out of date, the thing under consideration may be hidden from the imagery, the person considering deletion might simply be poor at aerial interpretation.

Hey, I was just in Mechanicstown a few weeks ago, and I saw no sign that the Orange Heritage Trail Extension goes THROUGH the building north of East Main Street. I'm pretty sure that the trail stopped at East Main Street.

Could you fix this?

Can you give me a lat/lon for what you are trying to point me to?

He is continuing the practice of deleting abandoned railroads: changeset/134926999

You were asked to stop doing this. Please comply.

It's hard enough to keep these edits accurate without someone vandalizing them all the time.

Maybe we can come to some sort of accommodation? I will start tagging razed sections of rail, and you will leave New York State alone. Is that acceptable to you?

Reverting. Your edits are unreliable. I have been to these places, and you are deleting OBVIOUS railbeds. OBVIOUS. Unless, of course, you are relying on aerial photos, in which case you are being unreliable. Stop it.

Hey, Greg, did you add the Lima and Honeoye Falls Railroad based on field work? My wife and I went looking for it today, and couldn't find anything.

Your "a lot of people" is four people that you could identify by name. That's not a lot.

I still don't see the value in deleting things that someone else has added. They had a reason for adding it.

It's a "firebreak" exactly where the road goes? Give me a break, you're clowning me.

My philosophical complaint about deletionism is that it is FAR FAR easier to select and hit delete than it is to find these things in the first place. Multiple days of exploration, getting the routing correct, and some armchair mapper (NOT you! but others) can't see it on an aerial and hit delete.

I suppose you also didn't see this? Obviously looks like a road to me. https://www.google.com/maps/@41.3908067,-76.2778874,3a,55y,240.79h,82.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sPJa_yBqaL6k1MxZt9YJlRw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Yes, Frederik and I have been at loggerheads for decades now. He thinks that abandoned railroads should NEVER be mapped, and if they're still visible, they should be mapped as embankment=yes or barrier=fence or whatever. He's welcome to be wrong, I've given up on getting wisdom from him.

I realize that people disagree with me over the value of mapping abandoned railroads. The Facebook group "Abandoned Railroads" has 109K users so clearly people want them mapped.

I don't see the value in deleting things that someone else has added. Thank you, by the way, for contacting me rather than simply deleting this road. I guess you missed the abutments upstream on Mahoopany Creek?

I saw from your profile that you don't want anything which could be tagged as abandoned to be in OSM. Is that a fair characterization? But why keep the name Ricketts when the town has been abandoned? Clearly there is value in mapping things that exist in the real world, including ghost town names and ghost town roads.

I'm sorry you feel that way about mapping abandoned things, but if it exists, I'm going to map it, and if people aren't using it, I'll tag it accurately as abandoned.

Perhaps you should spend more time mapping things that you care about than fighting about the things other people are about? It's not like OSM is full! There are tons of poorly mapped (that is, TIGER) rural roads in PA that you could fix.

You can see it on the LIDAR just in case you have never been in Ricketts the ghost town, not the state park: russnelson.com/temp/Ricketts-road.png

Your comments are very hostile. I am not going to supply you with ANY evidence because you will not believe it any more than you will believe my word. If you want to see the evidence go there. I suggest you park in the parking lot with the historic sign next to Mehoopany Creek. That will give you a good view of it.